The Law of Identity

post by Chris_Leong · 2023-02-06T02:59:16.397Z · LW · GW · 5 comments

Contents

5 comments

Summary: When we define the range of possible values for a variable X, we are fixing an ontology, that is, a way of carving up the space of values. The Law of Identity asserts that this ontology respects a given equivalence function.

Wikipedia defines the Law of Identity as follows: "In logic, the law of identity states that each thing is identical with itself". It is often written as X=X.

While this law seems straightforward, it is anything but once we start digging into what it actually means. The challenge is that it's very difficult to say what this law means without stating a tautology.

Take, for example, the definition above. What does it mean for a thing (let's say A, to be concrete) to "be identical with itself"?

Well, in order for this to make sense we need to have a model where A is not identical to itself which we can reject. If we don't have such a model to reject, then this statement will be tautological.

We can represent this using set theory as follows:

  1. Let  be a set containing  and  (ie. ). Here A is the "thing" and we're assigning it two separate sub-things that "are it" so that we can talk about them being equal to each other or not. We can think of A as corresponding to a congruence relation in set theory.
  2. When checking if  is identical to itself, we'll be checking if . If there were more than two variables, then we would do a pairwise comparison of elements. If instead of numbers, they are something like formulas applied to a specific value, then we'll have to evaluate them before making the comparison.

We can now consider some concrete examples (apologies if the examples are repetitive):

I could keep going and listing different scenarios, but as we can see the Law of Identity is actually pretty complicated underneath and can represent quite different things in different scenarios.

In each scenario, we had a variable that could potentially be further sub-divided (ie. by indexing on the copy, computation, observation or retrieval). We discussed the conditions when it would make sense to work with the course-grained variable (represented by the set) and when it would make sense to work with the fine-grained variables (represented by individual variables). In this article, we considered numerical equivalence, but it works with other kinds of equivalence as well.

Consequences

I think understanding the Law of Identity is a pretty good starting point for trying to understand the nature of logic and mathematics. After all, it's pretty much the simplest law out there. And if you don't have a clear explanation of this law, then that might be a hint that you're not ready to tackle the deeper questions yet. 

I guess that if we took this understanding of the Law of Identity and try to extrapolate that out to a theory of logic, the natural way to do this would be to produce a non-Cartesian view of logic where logic describes an abstraction for thinking about the agent's interactions with the world and/or the agent's understanding of its own cognition.

Let me know if you think I should write something about some of the other basic axioms of logic, but to be honest, I'm not really planning to do so at the moment, as I think extending this kind of reasoning to those axioms should be relatively straightforward.

Addendum:

Justis suggested adding the following example to further clarify when the Principle of Identity doesn't hold: "Suppose you're playing a game and a certain enemy always drops one of three things, but the precise thing varies randomly. It could drop a gold, silver, or bronze coin, for example. Then enemyDrop() != enemyDrop(), so identity in some sense doesn't hold on invocation."

On the other hand, you may have enemyDrop(seed) = enemyDrop(seed). So again, the law only holds when your variable is sufficiently fine-grained.

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comment by Rupert · 2023-02-06T09:24:33.864Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

I made the following observation to Chris on Facebook which he encouraged me to post here.

My point was basically just that, in reply to the statement "If we don't have such a model to reject, the statement will be tautological", it is in fact true relative to the standard semantics for first-order languages with equality that there is indeed no model-combined-with-an-interpretation-of-the-free-variables for which "x=x" comes out false. That is to say, relative to the standard semantics the formula is indeed a "logical truth" in that sense, although we usually only say "tautology" for formulas that are tautologies in propositional logic (that is, true under every Boolean valuation, a truth-valuation of all subformulas starting with a quantifier and all subformulas which are atomic formulas which then gets extended to a truth-valuation of all subformulas using the standard rules for the propositional connectives). So most certainly "x=x" is universally valid, relative to the standard semantics, and in the sense just described, there is no counter-model.

I take it that Chris' project here is in some way to articulate in what sense the Law of Identity could be taken as a statement that "has content" to it. It sounds as though the best approach to this might be to try to take a look at how you would explain the semantics of statements that involve the equality relation. It looks as though it should be in some way possible to defend the idea that the Law of Identity is in some way "true in virtue of its meaning".

Replies from: Chris_Leong
comment by Chris_Leong · 2023-02-06T10:49:13.847Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

So most certainly "x=x" is universally valid, relative to the standard semantics, and in the sense just described, there is no counter-model.

Indeed. If we want such a counter-model, then we'll need a different formalisation. This is what I provided above.

It looks as though it should be in some way possible to defend the idea that the Law of Identity is in some way "true in virtue of its meaning".


I would be surprised if this were the case. I guess my argument above doesn't aim to argue for the Law of Identity a priori, but rather as a way of representing that our variables don't need to be more fine-grained given a particular context and a particular equivalence function. In other words, we adopt the Law of Identity because it is part of a formalisation (more properly, a class of formalisations) that is useful in an incredibly wide range of circumstances. At least part of why this is useful so widely because we can use it to formalise parts of our cognition and we use our cognition everywhere.

comment by [deleted] · 2023-02-06T04:25:32.061Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

In reality, the identity thing is a bit of a misnomer. It's basically identifying objects based on its properties. One atom is not the same as another atom, even though they are both atoms. They exist separately in the same space. They are identical in terms of properties we care about, until we observe that they don't anymore. These little logic tricks are basically shorthand for simplification for the practical purpose of mental processing.

Replies from: Chris_Leong
comment by Chris_Leong · 2023-02-06T06:35:51.204Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

Agreed!

(I'd be curious to see the reason for the downvotes on this and its parent comment. Not criticising, just curious)

Replies from: None
comment by [deleted] · 2023-02-06T14:28:57.635Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

I've been wanting to write a bit about voting vs providing feedback for awhile. I'll try a little bit here.

Voting is mostly in the business of emotions while commenting is mostly in the business of rationality. Most people vote with their emotions, which is extremely hackable (marketing, political campaigning, etc.). Some vote with rationality, but you wouldn't know which is which because it's just a vote and most people operate mostly on the emotional level, or at least it's the first level of response that the person experiences.

If you go on most social media sites, you will see most people also comment based on their emotions. They will read a statistical statement, and then they will start commenting "I blah blah blah..." This phenomenon says a lot about the nature of voting if the same people commenting are also the same people voting.

If you have nothing of substance and value to offer, voting is a way for your "voice" to be heard. It gives the user a sense of agency and promotes engagement on the platform. This is why old forums are dead and lack perpetual engagement compared to the more modern forms of social media.

I wonder if in the long term this type of ingrained mechanism will devolve society into gamification mess. Based on the current trend of technological development and its role in the statistical nature of social engagement in the digital age, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of jobs that AGI replaces will end up being some form of gamification based on the agency of the ego while the AI serves its role as a form of an umpire.