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Comment by Skyfort on Fake Morality · 2007-11-09T21:39:52.000Z · LW · GW

Tom, clever as it is to substitute antonyms, you're a liar. :)

(When ever people knowingly worship demons, it is because they feel that the "dark gods" will actually get things done.)

Comment by Skyfort on Fake Morality · 2007-11-09T19:47:38.000Z · LW · GW

1) They claim that morality arises from god, i.e., they wish to define morality as obeying god's commands.

2) "God is good," is an explicit part of their doctrines.

There's no tension between these two statements, and "God is good" is meaningful. :) Statement #1 follows directly from Statement #2. Swap the numbers on those statements and you'll have the right of it.

Comment by Skyfort on Fake Morality · 2007-11-09T04:04:33.000Z · LW · GW

You wield the word fundamentalist like an accusation, as if fundamental principles are to be avoided. Stop that.

Also, please be aware that very few people will assert that our moral compass comes wholly from a fear of punishment. Biblically speaking, people were generally expected to know the difference between right and wrong. That is our inheritance, of course. Mankind has eaten the fruit of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, see? ;)

When God-worshiping fundamentalists say that God is the source of all morality, we do not mean that we are conscienceless critters, automatons always needing a nudge. Better to say "Only God is good" and makes good things. God is the source of goodness as the North Pole is the source of northness...if our compasses point that direction, chalk it up to natural attraction. (But in this case the compass points heavenward, not northward, and we could never make the hike).

On another note, you're mixing up judgment and discipline. Judges do not (or should not) punish wrongdoers in order to "teach them a lesson" or "set an example". Judgment is the punishing of wrongdoing because it is wrong and deserves to be punished. Mercy in judgment is an obstruction of justice for the sake of love -- it is a withholding of punishment. Mercy in discipline may be something else entirely, may even put the beloved through pain and misery. That is because discipline IS concerned with "teaching a lesson"...and a good judge will only punish you in proportion to your wickedness, but a good father's discipline might stretch on seemingly for ever, an unearned gift in proportion to your need.

So do not confuse God's Judge Hat with his Father Hat, as so many people do. Even his worshipers get confused. Judgment exists because evil is intolerable. Discipline exists because Love is inexhaustible.

As a final point, does anyone here really believe that if people think something is wrong, they will never do it? There was no direct implication of that in the article...but perhaps a whiff of the sentiment. No man with standards worth mentioning has ever lived up to them.