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comment by PatrickDFarley · 2023-03-31T12:39:28.663Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
If there existed a paradigm that is more truthful than 'rationality' as you have been taught it, how would you even know?
Easy. Predictive power.
It seems like you have strong feelings about rationality without actually knowing what that word means here
Replies from: TAG, ZT5↑ comment by TAG · 2023-03-31T15:18:42.869Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
If there existed a paradigm that is more truthful than ‘rationality’ as you have been taught it, how would you even know?
Easy. Predictive power.
If Bay Area rationality is basically correct, it can recognise improved versions of itself.
Corollary: If it isn't basically correct, it can't necessarily recognise some better epistemology.
Moral: It takes an epistemology to judge an epistemology.
Replies from: PatrickDFarley↑ comment by PatrickDFarley · 2023-03-31T17:32:00.025Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
These are tautologies. What is the point you're getting at?
Replies from: TAG↑ comment by TAG · 2023-03-31T17:52:22.145Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
"Predictive power" isn't the answer to everything . For tautologous reasons. (Whatever problem tautologies have, it isn't lack of truth).
Replies from: PatrickDFarley↑ comment by PatrickDFarley · 2023-03-31T18:10:24.431Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
I didn't say it was the answer to everything. The original phrasing was "more truthful."
Replies from: TAG↑ comment by TAG · 2023-03-31T18:12:13.487Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
The implication was that you already have an epistemology capable of judging any other.
Replies from: PatrickDFarley↑ comment by PatrickDFarley · 2023-03-31T18:23:13.055Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
Is this an epistemology?
I have experiences, and some interpretations of those experiences allow me to predict future experiences.
↑ comment by ZT5 · 2023-03-31T13:25:03.367Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
Explain why not all humans are rationalists, then. If the paradigm of rationality has more predictive power than their paradigms.
Explain how it feels from inside, for humans, to look at rationality and fail to update, despite rationality being objectively better.
Replies from: PatrickDFarley↑ comment by PatrickDFarley · 2023-03-31T15:05:24.956Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
What would it mean for rationality to be "objectively better"? It depends what the objective is. If your objective is "predictive power," then by some definitions you are already a rationalist.
Is your issue that predictive power isn't a good objective, or that there are better methods for prediction than those discussed on this site?
comment by monkymind · 2023-03-31T09:09:39.577Z · LW(p) · GW(p)
I was wrong much more than this | many times.
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
Spoken from my heart and mind, these may not resonate with you as false, and that means you’re wrong
The universe is out to get me
All people are out to get me
Constantly watching your life in third person is normal and healthy
Chess is a better game than go
Emotions are the opposite of truth, and will mostly mislead you.
My abusive fathers didn’t love me at all
My abusive fathers didn’t hurt me
My mother loved me strictly less than her God
My mother didn’t hurt me
My mother isn't extremely compassionate and loving
True love doesn’t exist
Hate is stronger than love
I didn’t call my mother 2 hours after reading your comment
Hell comes after death and not before it
My life is meaningless
There is an objective way to make life more meaningful to me
I can’t directly feel and interface with other people’s souls (consciousnesses)
I am lazy
I am dumb
I am weak
I have to be perfect
I need to put the needs of the people I love before my own
It is wrong to be angry
It is wrong to be sad
It is wrong to be happy
It is wrong to be alive
I can’t make the world a better place
The world is beyond saving
People don’t want my help
I can’t meaningfully contribute to a community full of people more intelligent than me
I can’t help myself
I’m beyond love
My friends don’t love me
My friends don’t love me if they aren’t people pleasers
Memes are stupid
Memes are mostly just funny
There were strong arguments against evolution
Conservative people are evil
Muslims are evil
Most Muslims are terrorists
Most black people are not smart
Most white people are evil
White people should pay for the sins of their parents
Most people are stupid
I can’t learn something from every person
People should pay for the sins of their parents
I should pay for the sins of my parents
I can’t be right
I can’t be right about anything
I don’t know anything
I will never know anything with certainty
The only thing I can know is that I’m conscious
I should only watch out for myself
Crying is embarrassing
Writing this comment is embarrassing
I shouldn’t cry in front of my friends and family
I shouldn’t cry because I read this post
I shouldn’t express any “negative” emotion to my friends or family
My friends and family don’t love me
Repressing emotions is healthy
Repressing emotions didn’t cause my dissociation
I don’t have a shadow
I’m not smart enough to study computer science
I’m not smart enough to study philosophy
I’m definitely not smart enough to study math
Learning should come easy
If you learned something easily it isn’t worth sharing
I am alone
My loneliness will be permanent
Being lonely is just a consequence of existence
We know how we got here
We don’t know what to do here
We know what’s coming next
Philosophers are stupid
Philosophers need to be more pragmatic
Nietzsche is evil
Nietzsche was dumb
Depression is bad for me
Mania is bad for me
I can’t get smarter after my brain has fully developed
I’ll never speak English fluently
People are scary
People are always judging me
People are always looking at me
Quiet sound isn’t extremely loud
Soft touch isn’t extremely loud
Pain isn’t extremely loud
Everyone can identify people from their footsteps
Sam Harris is correct about everything
Jordan Peterson is correct about everything
Charles Dawkins is correct about everything
John Vervaeke can help others but not me
I can be correct about everything
I need to constantly strive to be correct about everything
Other people’s feelings don’t physically hurt me
I’m not creative
I’m not
I can’t write music people want to listen to
I can’t improvise
I can’t improvise in front of my family
I can’t improvise in front of my friends
I can improvise in front of strangers ;)
I don’t have a gift for music
I wasn’t born to be an artist
I didn’t pursue music as a career out of wisdom and not fear
Sharing things that hurt other people is wrong
Every criticism of me is true
Every criticism of me is valuable
Every criticism of me should be entertained
I will never be confident
I will never be happy
I’m good at interviewing ;)
I’m not good enough to get a PhD ;)
People in academia are generally unkind
People are generally unkind
I’m not extremely neurotic
I should dislike myself
I should hate myself
I shouldn’t be myself
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Spoken from my heart and mind, these may not resonate with you as false, and if using reason, you can explain why they don’t directly hurt me and I agree with you, I would never try to change your mind