Subitisation of Self

post by vitaliya · 2023-02-01T09:18:49.784Z · LW · GW · 4 comments

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4 comments

Subitising is looking at a collection of objects and, as gestalt, assessing the number present without manual counting. It's about as basic of a System 1/2 split as you can get: children need to count manually, with each tallied increment taking effort; as we get used to seeing small collections of things in the real world, we group them together and treat the collection as atomic.

In digit grouping - e.g. presentation not as 1000000, but as 1,000,000, with the use of comma as delimiter - we again subitise chunk-by-chunk, determining the latter representation to be one million far faster than the former. We subitise straight to "two chunks of three zeroes", whereas without that convenience we often need to manually tally our million.

What is the self?

When we speak of "I", there's a bunch of targets and capabilities. For example, "I remember X", "I can Y", "I value Z". And so when we talk about the self, we combine this collection of capacities into a coherent gestalt, subitised down to one, an "I". And on thinking about this, I don't much like it.

The self that remembers has episodic, semantic, procedural memory components, each linked to but not properly contingent on the others. The removal of, say, my procedural memory of how to type [LW · GW] isn't really, in an especially important way, a removal of "who I am". While I have many formative memories, no specific recollection is properly core to the self I would formulate.

Similarly, manipulation of any specific value retains my sense of self. If you were to induce in me some pathological murderous desires, leaving all other elements intact, the result would still in some sense be "me". At the same time, we're quite comfortable saying that, if I entered into such a state, I'm "not myself".

How Do Optical Illusions Work?
The Kanizsa Triangle

The boundaries are fuzzy here. There is some sense in which the above image contains "two triangles" - the outer perimeter, with a point facing upwards, and the other one being eaten by three pac-men. Neither triangle is "really there", in the sense of a contiguous shape, but when I refer to them, I imagine you have some understanding of The Thing I'm Pointing At With Words.

If I were to erase just one black pixel in the above image, I haven't really "removed" either triangle. Yet there's also some threshold of pixels I can remove beyond which there's a blank image, and neither triangle would remain present in any sense. The exact boundary of "triangle removal" is dependent on the order and number of pixels removed - it's an "I know it when I see it" kind of thing.

My "self" is like a triangle. There is a sense in which any small perturbation to me retains the "selfness" present, which when compounded will eventually eliminate it. The version of me with any specific atom removed would comfortably remain "still me". But random removal of 90% of my atoms would probably eliminate whatever me-ness remains.

I use this as a model for counterfactuals. When someone says "I could have done it differently", what they actually mean to say is, "my category of self-ness would include a version of me which took different actions". The disagreement seems almost always to focus on "could have", with the "I" being an assumption about the particular configuration of atoms composing your cells composing your brain and body and what have you. But it's the "I" that is the fuzzy bit.

In vernacular usage, we pretend "I" is a unified thing, subitising up not just disparate components of our own brain, but abstract variations on it which don't "really" exist, not seeing them as individual components but as the One Collection That Is Me. We distend our sense of self across counterfactuals, a high-dimensional set of acceptable perturbations. But then, this is obvious, in so far as "self" is something that exists across time. The "you" that started reading this sentence isn't quite the "you" that finished it, but you're comfortable with the literary convenience of saying they're "still me". Your self's smeared across time and space and dimensions that aren't real - we're weird little blobs, are humans.

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comment by Richard_Kennaway · 2023-02-01T10:06:57.669Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

This does not differ from any other "thing". Take one grain of sand from a heap and "the heap" is still there, but scatter them all and it isn't. To its fans, a football team is the "same" team even over a space of years that sees all the players changed. There are shrines in Japan, such as Ise Jingu, which are destroyed and rebuilt every 20 years but Ise Jingu is still Ise Jingu, considered to be renewed by the rebuilding, not replaced. The Ship of Theseus.

Replies from: LVSN, lahwran
comment by LVSN · 2023-02-01T18:48:30.393Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

There is a big difference, actually. We do not punish heaps of sand. Society should move beyond everything that is analogous to killing an entire family [LW · GW] for the careless cruelty of one member.

"It especially annoys me when racists are accused of 'discrimination.' The ability to discriminate is a precious faculty; by judging all members on one 'race' to be the same, the racist precisely shows himself incapable of discrimination."
— Christopher Hitchens

Replies from: Richard_Kennaway
comment by Richard_Kennaway · 2023-02-01T19:18:54.488Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

I cannot see what your reply has to do with my comment or the OP.

comment by the gears to ascension (lahwran) · 2023-02-01T20:50:19.247Z · LW(p) · GW(p)

It seems to me that you and LVSN are slicing the implied concept this post describes into a referenced conceptual thing at different boundaries. I tried to explain how I see the difference, but found I'm uncertain in my guesses of both of your meanings, so all I can honestly claim is that both of your reactions are reasonable according to my mental concept parser, but that LVSN's reaction highlights some of why I find this post important. Perhaps the point could be summarized, "it is important that any model of selfhood recognize that it is a thing [LW · GW] which is defined by the thing itself", thus including the same point you make and yet also distilling the insight the post is attempting to highlight.