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Comment by eurg on Self-verification · 2015-04-20T13:41:14.368Z · LW · GW

As others pointed out, "memory wipe" is a broad category, but assuming that this is about episodic memory:

How about sending yourself a letter via delivery service on a specific date in handwriting + audio-recording? This of course completely ignores any other faked messages that would need to be discarded, but even with only episodic memory loss, I assume I'd be so confused as to be easy game for even the most incompetent scammer.

If this is about formal guarantees, we need to have some more precise ideas about the "memory wipe" and the adversary in question. In the most general case, likely game over.

Comment by eurg on 2014 Less Wrong Census/Survey · 2014-11-01T12:24:24.604Z · LW · GW

Did it, as every year. Thanks for your work.

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-03-23T19:06:10.762Z · LW · GW

Similar experience, and not much of real advice. I mostly solve it by setting up obligations by myself. However, I revert to this only for stuff that is important. Examples:

I've announced and discussed doing some boring accounting and controlling for the hackerspace, and people now expect some specific results.

On anothor note, instead of procrastinating about finding a better workplace, I gave my notice. Once I was out of the job, I simply had to start looking.

Finally, I do not need to be perfect. More people than I expected have the odd day or two during the workweek, and knowing this I have reset my expectations regarding my own performance to something more humane.

Comment by eurg on Don't teach people how to reach the top of a hill · 2014-03-17T13:54:26.017Z · LW · GW

I was doing this in the past to heavy-weight books for very pragmatic reasons: Gödel, Escher, Bach is worthless to me if the book would just sit around in a corner, but to take it with me and read it while commuting, I had to get the weight down.

Since learning this amazing trick, any book I read and that's inconvenient to hold has to fear the knife.

Comment by eurg on Shoulds can be changed to Cans · 2014-03-15T09:44:43.764Z · LW · GW

Depending on personal specifics, such stuff is also used in psychotherapy; overburdening oneself is not an uncommon problem. For me this helped even though such substitutions were all but universal, I don't know about how important it is in general, though.

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-02-02T17:07:07.946Z · LW · GW

I'm sorry to have not answered for so long, I had some busy weeks.

Depression: I'd suffered many months from a depression bad enough that I was not able to work the hours of a part-time job, let alone achieve any acceptable performance. I was using alcohol as replacement for other diluted variants of H2O. This was also not the first time of being depressed, and needless to say, such things can fuck up your life, and are generally not very desirable.

I recovered as well as I think possible: I feel well. I can work. I enjoy, and can concentrate on stuff that piques my interest. I feel secure enough to make plans spanning more than two days, and expect to be somewhere between OK and very good for the forseeable future. For most measures, I am now better functioning, healthier (physically and emotionally) than the average person.

The sword of Damokles being that the next episode might break through my defenses so fast that I break down. Again. If I remember correctly, there is a four in five chance there will be one. I do not worry about that, though.

Therapy: The most useful part of my therapy was the judicious choice of some small things to work on, and the frequent feedback from an outsider. Also, never underestimate by how much a therapist approaches problems differently than a damaged brain.

On my own I would either not do anything, and hate myself for it, or try something, and hate myself for failing (again), or do something, and hate myself for spending energy on such a worthless, embarassingly tiny task. It was primarily option one.

It took some months, but through repeated experience I came to accept slight progress as progress nevertheless, and many of the tasks I was given to do integrate very nicely into everday activities now. I learned about saying "Well done!" to myself. I also learned about building habits, not as in 'scientist', but but applied to my own life. I also made it through some setbacks, faster and better than in the past years, so there is the chance that I actually learned something useful.

Last but not least, after a severe and sudden setback about two months or so, my therapist set me up with a psychiatrist to get some nice pills. A few days later I slept better than for the last ten years. Sleep is great. Everybody should get some.

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-13T00:00:59.097Z · LW · GW

What do you enjoy most in software development, and why are you going to be looking for a job again soon? What's your dream SW dev job?

Cannot really answer what I enjoy most; I like almost every job that comes up, with only a few exceptions. I hate repeating myself, and I hate having to do things in a ... ... ... way against my better judgement. I prefer to work more time (as in effort and calender time) doing the architecture/design/coding parts, but I also prefer doing other stuff once in a while more than being purely a lonely coder.

I will give my notice in a few hours, so I'll than search for a new job. I will have two months time for that, though, and maybe I take some time off before starting in a new company. I'll end this job because neither one of money, project nor team is good enough to make me happy, and the job market for software developers allows for searching for improved conditions.

My dream SW job would involve writing open source software which somehow tangibly improves the lives of some people (think better medical DAq and analysis instead of the newest photo sharing app), working with a team where competence and respect is wide-spread, as is friendlyness, and pay which is not worse than I what I got when I was still failing to drop out of college. Sadly, I do not think such a job exists, especially not for people like me (who do not have the necessary skills for anything fancy).

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-12T23:51:23.406Z · LW · GW

What's your motivation for veganism?

Moral reasons. All else equal, I think that inflicting pain or death is bad, and that the ability to feel pain and the desire to not die is very widespread. I also think that the intensity of pain in simpler animals is still very strong (I think humans did not evolve large brains because otherwise the pain was not strong enough). I also think that our ability to manage pain slighly reduces the impact of our having the ability to suffer more strongly and with more variety. But I give, for sanity check reasons, priority to the desires of "more complex" animals, like humans.

Due to our technical ability we can now produce supplements for micronutrient which are missing or insufficently available in plants[1], and so I see health concerns resolved. So all the pain and death that I would inflict would only be there for greated enjoyment of food. Although I love the taste of meat and animal products, the comparative enjoyment is not big enough that I would kill for it. That I can enjoy plant-based foods is partly based upon my not being afraid of using my kitchen, and having a good vegan/vegetarian self-service restaurant 100m from my apartment.

And than there are the environmental reasons, and the antibiotic use, etc. etc. They count, and might be even sufficent on their own, but I'll only investigate those in case my other concerns/reasons were invalidated.

[1] There is vegan vit B12, vit D3, EPA/DHA (omega3), and creatin powder.

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-12T23:25:05.596Z · LW · GW

Thanks!

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-12T23:21:13.228Z · LW · GW

This was surprisingly simple: I got myself to want to run, started running, and patted myself on the back everytime I did it.

The want part was a bit of luck: I always thought I "should" do some sports, for physical and more importantly mental health reasons, and think that being able to do stuff is better than not being able, ceteris paribus. So I was thinking what kind of activity I might prefer.

I like my alone time (so team- or pair-sports are out), I dislike spending money when I expect it to be wasted (like Gym memberships, bikes, et al.). And I feel easily embarassed and ashamed, and like to get myself at least somewhat up to speed on my own.

Running fits those side requirements. Out of chance I got hold of "Born to Run", and even after the first quarter of the book I thought that it would be great if I could just go out on a bad day and spend an hour free of shit, or how it would be great that I could just reach some location a few kilometers away without any prep or machines or services.

I then decided that I will start running, and that my primary goal shall be that I like it and be able to do it even in old age if such would happen. With the '*' that I give myself an easy way out in case of physical pain or unexpected hatred against the activity, but not for any weasel reasons.

I didn't start running for another one and a half years, because Schweinehund, subtype Innerer. When my mood was getting slightly better (I was again able to do productive work), I started, with the "habit formation" mind-set. Also didn't tell anyone in the beginning. I think it helped that I already had some knowledge on how to train and run correctly, which especially in the beginning meant that I always felt like I could run further than I was "allowed" to.

And for good feedback: However it went, when I finished my training, I "said" to myself: I did good. I feel good. I feel better than before I started. I wrote every single run down on RunKeeper and Fitocracy, and always smiled at the "I'm awesome!" button of the latter one. I'm also quite sure that having at least one new personal best once a week helped. (Also, when you run barefoot, you get the "crazy badass" card for free, however slow you run. I like this.)

Once started, such a feedback loop is quite powerful. When I once barely trained for month, I was also surprised that getting back into regular running after that down-phase was so much easier. Now, after only seven months of training, I went from doing walk/run for 15 minutes to running 75 minutes, and having no problem with a cold-start 6% incline for the first two kilometers. I'm proud. Feels good (is quite new to me).

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-12T16:48:57.804Z · LW · GW

No, not by myself. Wouldn't have the skillset for it, anyways. So I only try to introduce people to things like MIRI, to improve the chances that future discussions might not stop dead in fatalistic and nihilistic clichés. Effective altruism is an angle where I try to get a sense if a worthwhile elaboration is possible, as steering the arguments is somewhat easier when not starting with the most crazy stuff first.

Comment by eurg on AALWA: Ask any LessWronger anything · 2014-01-12T16:35:21.322Z · LW · GW

Ask me almost anything. I'm very boring, but I have recovered from depression with the help of CBT + pills, am a lurker since back from the OB days and know the orthodoxy here quite well, started to enjoy running (real barefoot if >7 degrees Celsius) after 29 years of no physical activity, am chairman of the local hackerspace (software dev myself, soon looking for a job again), and somehow established the acceptance of a vegan lifestyle in my conservative familiy (farmers).

Comment by eurg on 2013 Less Wrong Census/Survey · 2013-11-23T16:54:19.884Z · LW · GW

Value of information is zero. Do it if you are curious, or take the money and watch some movies with friends.

Comment by eurg on 2013 Less Wrong Census/Survey · 2013-11-23T16:51:13.831Z · LW · GW

Also, in many European countries it means "pre- and post some different tax". Because one part is payed by the employer, and the other by the employee. Populism, Politics and Economics. Good results guaranteed.

Comment by eurg on 2013 Less Wrong Census/Survey · 2013-11-23T16:45:55.072Z · LW · GW

Survey taken, as always. It sure was well prepared. It's worth starting it for the first option (ruining everything), and continuation is always just one click away...

Comment by eurg on Humans are utility monsters · 2013-08-18T17:49:32.750Z · LW · GW

You are right, of course. I did not want to imply that a vegan diet would have been feasible until recent advances.

Comment by eurg on Humans are utility monsters · 2013-08-18T15:34:33.576Z · LW · GW

The asking for forgiveness may indicate that people somehow thought of the act as killing, but that did not change their actions. Humans have had a distinctive influence on the local megafauna wherever they showed up. A cynic might write that "humans did not really care about the well-being of ...". We for instance also have taboos of eating dogs and cats, but the last time I checked it was not because of value their lives, but because they are cute. It's mostly organized lying to feel OK.

Comment by eurg on Common Task Time Estimation Repository · 2013-08-02T11:11:35.554Z · LW · GW

Read a 350-page novel in your 2nd language: 9 hrs (work & elapsed)

Comment by eurg on Giving Now Currently Seems to Beat Giving Later · 2013-06-24T12:20:15.097Z · LW · GW

In Austria, where for all practical matters and purposes charity donations are not tax-deductible, the animal welfare group Vier Pfoten is doing this. Doesn't make it more attractive to me, though...

Comment by eurg on Post ridiculous munchkin ideas! · 2013-05-12T15:44:22.371Z · LW · GW

after tax pay of 75k a year isn't crazy unusual [...] in major cities

Less than half of that isn't crazy unusual everywhere else. Of course, anybody can just move there, and is qualified and lucky enough to find such a job.

Still doesn't change the OPs point, though; living on 15k/year is still a very convenient life.

Comment by eurg on What are your rules of thumb? · 2013-02-16T11:03:19.316Z · LW · GW

Also, if you want to pick up such a signal, it is helpful that you are not totally overworked or tired, and also not under the influence of a significant amount of disinhibiting substances.

Comment by eurg on Is suicide high-status? · 2013-02-12T10:48:14.313Z · LW · GW

"What else is there to explain?"

After about 0.5 seconds of thought, I might become interested whether suicide after status-loss has a different frequency in different cultures, and if yes, whether this difference can be explained in the respective way of handling the death of the person. The simple emotional question behind that is whether in all cultures suicides after a status-hit are more strongly motivated by the pain of the status-loss itself, or also by the expected development after death. I might even be interested in whether this question makes sense at all. Still, it remains something to be explained.

Also, "What else is there to explain?" sounds suspiciously like "Are you so stupid to not see that?".

Comment by eurg on Having Trouble Posting · 2013-02-08T16:12:24.263Z · LW · GW

I cannot fathom how this comment can be so downvoted. Snarky remarks do hurt, and pointing that out is necessary. Placing the duty to be charitable on the receiver is one of the primary failure modes of communication. I do understand that both LW and programmers draw an above average amount of their demographics from non-NT people, but rejecting the reality of emotions in the majority (even in the programmers group) will not improve anyone's experiences.

Comment by eurg on Meet up interest: Vienna, March · 2013-01-19T19:58:00.619Z · LW · GW

If the meet up would happen on a weekend, and be easily accessible with public transport, I'd visit.

Comment by eurg on My simple hack for increased alertness and improved cognitive functioning: very bright light · 2013-01-19T09:53:36.861Z · LW · GW

Also, if you buy RGB(W) LEDs and add some work, you can choose your rooms color temperature at will. Keep it at 6k if you want to work, let it shift gently to 2k3 to help with a regular sleep rhythm, make it turquoise for a party...

Comment by eurg on My simple hack for increased alertness and improved cognitive functioning: very bright light · 2013-01-19T09:47:22.373Z · LW · GW

Depends on how the bulb is build. The important factors are

  • light temperature: color tone; the temperature at which we would perceive a black body radiator to be of the same color
  • color rendition index: how good its light spectrum is compared to a black body, meaning if it doesn't miss any frequencies which we would perceive; incandescent bulbs have 100, good LEDs about 90, and currently average at 80 for living room LED bulbs
  • lumen/watt: efficiency as in perceived brightness per watt; not efficiency as in electric energy -> photons conversion

Most old-style incandescent bulbs have a simple build, and higher watt bulbs usually have a higher color temperature, and somewhat better efficiency. So, 4 60W would be severly different from 1 240W (such bulbs have been sold in the past, though not anymore; people prefer halogen for that now, because higher temperature incandescent bulbs usually have a much shorter life).

Halogen bulbs (I am always talking "quarz halogen" here; without Wikipedia I wouldn't have known others exist) are usually build for a specific temperature, and then you buy the wattage/brightness in lumen you want (where I live practically all halogen bulbs come in 2900 +/- 200 K); so you buy spot with 2900K, and have available everything from 10W to 40W, or a 300W "stick", again with 2900 K. Higher color temperature are available, but usually not at your first supermarket. BTW, you get around 4900 lumen for a 240W halogen stick.

With LEDs and CFLs everything gets fucking crazy. Whatever color temperature you prefer, don't get below a CRI of 85. It makes pictures look crazy, and after a while you want to rip out your eyes. 90 is really good, for professional photo work only 100 is 100.

Another guide for room lighting (personal experience): 2 klm at 20m² is just a bit more than cozy, 5 klm per 20m² are good enough (you can read, learn, work), but not office style. If the OP means "small room" at about 15 m², he should have the equivalent of 12 klm at 20m², which sounds about right for "feels brighter than winter outside", but it would not be (at 47 degrees north, that is).

Although having real bright light matters, to feel brighter you might want to make contrast. Your eyes/brain tell you "less bright" if everything has the same luminosity (that is the reason why on a cloudy day it feels darker on the outside than in your apartment, but as soon as you take a photograph you recognize it isn't). So: Get a dark spot somewhere.

Comment by eurg on My simple hack for increased alertness and improved cognitive functioning: very bright light · 2013-01-19T09:01:21.583Z · LW · GW

Well, I thought Kawoomba knew it better than me, and it would be a u-declination (africanus, -u). But no, according to the English Wictionary entry on africanus, it is a/o. So, africanam. Though the last time when I was learning latin was eight years ago, so...

(edit) When we are at it, what's it in Lojban?

Comment by eurg on Farewell Aaron Swartz (1986-2013) · 2013-01-13T17:08:01.535Z · LW · GW

Too optimistic.

Comment by eurg on Farewell Aaron Swartz (1986-2013) · 2013-01-13T11:34:46.980Z · LW · GW

It seems I am too incompetent to make myself understood.

Comment by eurg on New censorship: against hypothetical violence against identifiable people · 2012-12-27T17:44:42.939Z · LW · GW

Luckily enough, that blog seems much better than your introduction of it. My troll accusation is founded on your highly repetitive deliberate misunderstanding of the OP. It must be deliberate, as you are usually much smarter than that, and also better in style.

Also, Sister Y is not pro-suicide per se, but against anti-suicide positions; at least that's how I read it.

Comment by eurg on New censorship: against hypothetical violence against identifiable people · 2012-12-24T16:25:58.985Z · LW · GW

Forget about it.

Comment by eurg on Causal Diagrams and Causal Models · 2012-11-05T14:21:20.494Z · LW · GW

Thanks for clarifying!

Comment by eurg on Causal Diagrams and Causal Models · 2012-10-20T22:55:55.632Z · LW · GW

Is this another variation of the theme that one needs to assume the possibility of inductive reasoning to make an argument for it (or also assume Occam's Razor to argue for it)? Also, the specific example he gave seems to me like an instance of "given very skewed data, the best guesses are still wrong" (there was sometime a variation of that here, regarding bets and opponents who have superior information). Or are you thinking of something for subtle?

Comment by eurg on Firewalling the Optimal from the Rational · 2012-10-10T18:10:35.738Z · LW · GW

If "anything like that" includes reciting prayers, practically all catholic private schools in Europe will count.

Comment by eurg on Firewalling the Optimal from the Rational · 2012-10-10T17:29:30.801Z · LW · GW

Through use of the "seq_epistemology" tag this is possible via the "Article Navigation". Maybe this tag was only added after the comment? However, it works quite well!

Comment by eurg on "Hide comments in downvoted threads" is now active · 2012-10-05T14:28:27.586Z · LW · GW
  • unnecessary link and opinion retracted -
Comment by eurg on Less Wrong Polls in Comments · 2012-09-21T20:07:12.990Z · LW · GW

Which is too bad, as all incorrect options should have the same rights (for moral reasons).

Comment by eurg on Open Thread, September 15-30, 2012 · 2012-09-17T23:09:19.584Z · LW · GW

Thanks for digging that up! Also, I did not want to imply that only silly things are measured, but rather that the most interesting questions are still unanswered due to various constraints.

Comment by eurg on Open Thread, September 15-30, 2012 · 2012-09-17T12:28:38.976Z · LW · GW

I am a software developer, and have glimpsed over many similar questions. To summarize: There are enormous individual differences in how one can become a better programmer, and even more so on the opinions on it. It is not even easy to agree on what basic skills should be there at the "end" (i.e., the beginning, after your first two years real experience), much less on how to get those skills.

That said, most commonplace advice is valid here:

  • there is with high probability no really significant innate aptitude for programming (intelligence has a carry-over into many domains, however) (edit: seems I am wrong about that: See "Has “Not everyone can be a programmer” been studied?" at Programmers.StackExchange
  • don't expect too much skill carry-over: mathematical thinking and programming are related, but different activities
  • being able to concentrate for some time is good (a.k.a.: conscientiousness helps)
  • as a kid, liking the task probably also helps
  • playing the trumpet - not that much (though it can be fun)

On skill-set:

  • The practical coding skills are always important. (Except if you want to earn more than a dev.)
  • Algorithmic knowledge is rarely helpful, but you will stumble at least once if you don't have it (but nobody will notice).
  • Mathematics is necessary only in very small areas.

What should I have done? Training self-discipline would have helped (if something like that is possible). Knowing/Having somebody who is actually significantly better than me, and pushing me, would have helped (fuckarounditis on "learning" is too easy to do).

My Opinion: In professional software development there is very little time to broaden your knowledge -- it goes into obscure platform and domain knowledge quite quickly, and Jobs where you do what is actually interesting are in very short supply. However, exactly this broader knowledge is what can keep you afloat even if you happen to be neurotic, unreliable, slow worker*. So: Let him do what is most interesting, but gently guide him to do it just a bit better, and a little bit more diverse than he would otherwise. About interest: Many people say kids usually like somewhat quick results, and things that crawl. Maybe?

Preparatory learning exercises: Sorry, no opinion and idea here. I always liked to take things apart, and sometimes also to put them together (as in Lego Technik models, or -- almost always unsuccessful -- attempts to construct my own). Actually, I think constructing Lego models (or of course anything that is "more real") is great. But then there is the initial caveat of individual differences.

*: I might exaggerate a bit, but not too much.

Comment by eurg on Open Thread, September 15-30, 2012 · 2012-09-17T11:49:36.312Z · LW · GW

Is this really so strange?

No, but context and wording is sometimes everything. I assume that datadataeverywhere has imported some HN style startup discussion context here.

Comment by eurg on Open Thread, September 15-30, 2012 · 2012-09-17T11:45:11.630Z · LW · GW

Off-Topic Nit-Picking:

Evidence is building that High intensity interval training, e.g. Tabata sprints, is more effective at physical conditioning than low intensity endurance techniques.

"physical conditioning" is a very general term. For instance: Is evidence building that Tabata sprints are more effective for preparing for a 100k ultra-marathon?

Of course competitive runners do some sort of interval training, and -- if information on The Internet (reddit) is to be believed -- runners do not train the full distance. And if basic health and looks is your goal, running is probably not the most time-efficient (of even effective) way for doing it. But this "endurance is all wrong" meme is overshooting it a bit...

Comment by eurg on Open Thread, September 15-30, 2012 · 2012-09-17T11:37:20.160Z · LW · GW

I haven't heard of any studies in that direction, although a few people try to do find something, like "how long are the programs comparatively" etc., similar to this quickly googled IEEE paper.

I assume that because

  • programming languages are used by humans, and
  • most of a programming language's quality is based upon its actual effects on humans in the target group, and
  • for real work we value long-term effects

such a study is unfeasible, i.e. too much effort, too expensive. And probably not that much related to programming language features (as most popular languages converge to some degree, especially on the most important axises). Also, "fewer symbols/lexemes/special-purpose-constructs" is an advantage only under certain conditions, meaning: the question asked may very well already determine the answer.

Comment by eurg on How to deal with someone in a LessWrong meeting being creepy · 2012-09-08T18:54:05.340Z · LW · GW

In many social groups touching initiated from women is often received just as bad as from men, and fairly so. I am sure there are lots of groups with this specific double standard, but it is not universal, not by a large margin.

Also, "only explanation": Really?

Comment by eurg on Less Wrong Product & Service Recommendations · 2012-07-02T19:20:56.941Z · LW · GW

2nd'd too. I also recommend looking into c't ActiveAid (http://www.heise.de/download/activaid.html). It's a AutoHotkey script collection by the German computer magazine c't, and contains many goodies. The linked page is in German, but the application supports English.

I especially liked it for the excellent Multi-Monitor, Window-Placement, date/time/calendor, notetaking and screenshot support. Most of it is less important with Windows >= 7, but it's still helpful.

Comment by eurg on Rationality and Winning · 2012-05-05T16:03:55.112Z · LW · GW

I may be misreading this, but it seems to me that you inverted the meaning of akrasia.

Comment by eurg on Weekly LW Meetups: Copenhagen, Dallas, Graz, London, Longmont, Melbourne, Pittsburgh, Sydney, Vancouver, Washington · 2012-05-04T18:45:51.952Z · LW · GW

There's an oversight: You have added the non-regular April meet-ups as "upcoming".

Comment by eurg on Muehlhauser-Wang Dialogue · 2012-04-24T21:59:05.672Z · LW · GW

My comparison would be someone screaming at Dmitri Ivanovsky in 1892 "do not research viruses until you know that this research is safe!".

I want to second that. Also, when reading through this (and feeling the -- probably imagined -- tension of both parties to stay polite) the viral point was the first one that triggered the "this is clearly an attack!" emotion in my head. I was feeling sad about that, and had hoped that luke would find another ingenious example.

Comment by eurg on Our Phyg Is Not Exclusive Enough · 2012-04-16T21:32:34.915Z · LW · GW

It is explicitly mentioned (somewhere) that the wiki is only for referencing ideas and terms that have been used/discussed/explained in LW posts.

So, yes, inconvenience, but not solely.

Comment by eurg on Meetup : Graz Meetup · 2012-04-05T21:43:33.194Z · LW · GW

Ah, I just looked up my calender, and indeed, I have an important obligation on Sunday 22 already. In case anybody wonders, I'd have time the week after, and the one after that...

Comment by eurg on Meetup : Graz Meetup · 2012-04-02T13:28:48.659Z · LW · GW

I would rather avoid Tik-Tak as meet-up location, as well as similar bars/cafés. Loud music/loud crowd, little light, much smoke... These reasons are behind my suggestion to go to somewhere more restaurant-like.

I myself will refrain from proposing further places, as too many options won't make it any easier.