As a general heuristic, I think it's best to avoid relationships in which you intend to treat your partner's psychological disorders. If you're going to date someone with such disorders, make sure someone else is the therapist.

I used to be in the habit of playing therapist for others. One girl fell for me hard, and after dealing with her I can completely understand why therapists are forbidden to date their patients.

I didn't end up in a relationship with her, but when I gave her my final rejection, I ended up having to talk her down from suicide.

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"Watch out for when you are sacrificing epistemology for instrumental gains. If there is ever a time where you want to have certain beliefs because it more convenient and you are trying to talk yourself into them, that is a giant red flag."

Bingo. At times, I've thought something like this is the secret to being rational.

Many years ago I had an intense, year-long friendship with a girl with BPD. We didn't date (although she did permanently break off our friendship as if we were dating, something I hadn't known was a social possibility before then). I have to say, her emotional volatility was utterly mesmerising. During the time I knew her my thinking was utterly transformed. It wasn't so much her vulnerability or my desire to help her, more that it was impossible to keep up and it became exhilarating. I didn't know where I stood from one minute to the next. I could go from being her closest friend to her most hated enemy, and back again, in the space of one conversation. It was bizarre and incredibly addictive. During that time I convinced myself there was something wrong with me and with rationality in general. I got interested in continental philosophy, I toyed with spirituality. After she "broke up" with me, my old self returned. But it was an interesting experience. Almost like joining a cult.

A general point that I don't have quite framed, but deciding when something is bad enough to be worth changing, especially if that change will be socially disruptive, seems to be really hard. People tend to do a lot of checking with third parties, possibly because there may be a second party who's done a lot to present the current situation as objectively the best available.

I think this applies to whistle-blowing, emigration, and leaving jobs as well as to relationships.

This is terrifyingly similar to my relationship with my first girlfriend, "Alice."

I think a key part of that series is missing...

Since the series only has one part so far, basically all "key parts" are "missing." :)

Did you stop seeing your friends while you were with her? Social isolation seems to contribute to these things.

As I finished reading this, my girlfriend walked in and I forgot to upvote. I'm glad I remembered - this was a tremendously well done post. I'd like to see it in main.

The one part in this post that bothered me was the part about Cigarettes and Cannabis. I dislike the characterization of people who use them as stupid, I just think they need help optimizing their usage. Both vaporization of Cannabis and Tobacco combined with Nicotine stimulants can save you a great deal of money and also improve your health while using those substances. Similar measures can be taken with Pain Pills and Adderall, if you hadn't extricated yourself so thoroughly which I applaud you for I would refer you to A Rationalists guide to Psychoactive Drugs and other articles.

At some point during our relationship, I switched from thinking there was something wrong with her, to thinking there was something wrong with me.

Which, as you found out, was also true (codependency, significant changes to your personality).

Looking back, when do you think you SHOULD have gotten out of the relationship?

Funny note: because I moved this article to main, my karma is at 248 but my karma gained this month is at 395.

I just wanted to say thank you for this article. I know it might seem weird, but I am a female borderline. I actually am very into my DBT therapy and have made it my TOP priority in life. But I went searching for flowcharts and this was unbelievably good. Your work and effort to "save" someone you cared about went, as you probably know, above and beyond what she could have possibly comprehended as "helpful" because she lacked the basic skills to really thank you.

For the people and naysayers who like to envelop women [and some men] with BPD as monsters, incapable of true transcendence and life skills, you're absolutely wrong. I have had a plethora of very serious life crises that burned many bridges before the wonderful place I am in now I fondly refer to as "entering life through the back door."

think of this; we start as babies. we start as people who cry and need to be fed. we need to have emotional protection and to have needs met. very basic needs. somewhere, borderlines do not get this and we spend a lifetime of horrible, and yes, cliched existences to try and attain even a modicum of truth to who we are and that feeling of rationality and love. it is possible. You were right in leaving and as hard for a borderline to admit this, being left was the only thing that got me to the right long term commitment to therapy I so desperately needed.

And yes, were it not for my own desire to get better and experience authentic love and being, I'd never have gotten here- and I am not very sure that's something every borderline can attain, as it requires a thirst for knowledge and a somewhat high-functionality in the real world. [ie, having a job, owning a car, money are really helpful but extremely hard for borderlines to attain.] Luckily I am very close to my exes and they have been incredibly instrumental in my recovery process. [my ex fiance even bought the book "Everything about Borderline" for me recently. I have several other health issues, not the least of which is an eating disorder. But to respond to your ex's thoughts on "when i lose weight" i have to call bull. I was big and my mind just reversed polarity and split, so now I do not eat enough.

anyway, before I ramble on too much, I just wanted to say hi,and thank you again for this. It's always very insightful for a borderline woman in recovery to hear the real and undiluted thoughts of the partners. I love it because it helps me avoid things I really have no idea i am doing.

one last thing: think about Aspies and Autistic persons. They have unknown reasons for their lack of empathy and tendency toward verbosity to the point of boring everyone - yet we do not label them so harshly. Aspies can learn and a huge amount of money and research and care is taken to help them toward leading a normal life. I think we need to start thinking about BPD this way, or else I am afraid many more suicides will occur. A good combination of the tough love and soft encouragement is a good approach.

Thanks for your time. Kelly

People with BPD can be very addictive. The highs are so good - you wrack your brain trying to work out what you are doing wrong in the bad times. As Bordelines are often women, the gender politics of "it must be the man's fault" add to the confusion.

The random nature the the Borderline person's behavior is an almost perfect case of intermittent reinforcement.

The only solution is to extricate yourself as safely as possible. You can waste 1, 2, 10 or 30 years before you work this out.

It is very important to learn how to recognize two kinds of people / psychiatric disorders 1. Borderline Personality Disorder. 2. Psychopaths == Sociopaths.

Both can seriously damage your life.

Great post. But I'm a bit confused by the title. What does "dark arts" refer to? Does it refer to your ex's emotional manipulation? If so, I was under the impression that "dark arts" connotes a manipulation with conscious intent.

I also recently left a relationship with a girl with borderline personality disorder (my diagnosis, not professionally diagnosed). I love her. As scientism put it:

her emotional volatility was utterly mesmerising...it was impossible to keep up and it became exhilarating...It was bizarre and incredibly addictive.

I'm young and inexperienced in love. I'm worried that it was her BPD that made her so enchanting - she was so present, so spontaneous and radiant. I had the best times of my life with her.

Can others who have been with BPD types and then had relationships afterwards tell me: do you find love as intense as that again? Do you have the best times of your life with someone without also having the worst?

Edited in response to downvote to be less plaintive.

According to about.com (anyone have a better reference?)

The studies cited here say 9-10%.

When romance can go horribly wrong

Excellent change of title!

Good for you for finally DTMFA. Now, you have been through some serious emotional trauma for years (at least two, but I suspect more than that, given what you put up with), so you might have a PTSD, whether you realize it or not. Better see a professional about it... assuming you can afford it.

However, four months into the relationship, before much of this had happened, I proposed to her. I was always big on commitments. I felt that if you were dating someone, it was to eventually get married, assuming they were right for you.

I think a pretty good heuristic would be to never marry someone you have known less than a year. The only exceptions are if you've been married before or have been dating a rather long time and thus have a clear sense of what you're looking for. Of course, plenty of people don't know this.

Please allow me to offer a different perspective.

I remain extremely skeptical of psychological diagnosis. Studies continue to show that a year of psychoanalysis with a trained analyst remains less effective than reading a book on cognitive psychology focused on measured self-improvement. Similarly, psychologists are statistically unable to distinguish between 'normal' and neurotic patients. Tests on 'subjects' are prone to confirmation bias and inter-causality issues.

Humans are deeply social animals, and arguably our intelligence has evolved at least partly to meet the challenge of those associations. Our minds are also heavily prejudiced in favor of habits, especially those we adopt as children. IOW, we are acutely susceptible to gaining our life stories from our parents, and Walter Mischel's Marshmallow experiments arguably reflect those predilections, especially since we clothe our memories, responses and behaviors in a tight weave of rationality and emotion. Those stories are not only difficult to break, but inevitably produce consequences.

I am therefore skeptical of a 'personality disorder' named BPD. I was married to a woman who fits all the descriptions. My unwillingness to quit, my devotion to the institution of marriage, and my belief in my continued investment over time to produce healthful change eventually led me to thwart my career and spend hundreds of thousands of dollars in an effort to help her feel more secure and 'happy.' In the end, she actually left me, and I now support her and her boyfriend and my son and their daughter.

Do I think she is sick? I think she has control issues. I think she uses emotional commitment as leverage and her flight response is very high after she becomes convinced that her significant other will no longer act as savior or slave.

Does this make her sick? It certainly makes her socially inept, which reinforces her life story. By now I view her relationship requirements as very particular; just the right combination of attributes must be present to be successful. And many of her impulses lead to pain and unneeded hardship which takes an emotional and psychological toll.

But I do not view her as suffering from a 'malady.' I view her as a person whose life story tends to be often self-destructive. And without the benefit of constant daily guidance and an honest willingness to change, it is likely to remain so. Ultimately, despite awareness of her issues, it was me who could not get through. I am just sad I played the hostage game at all. I thought I was more mature than that.

Variable-ratio reinforcement schedule? Perhaps pre-committing to end any relationship in which the accuracy of your predictions concerning pleasure and pain doesn't show improvement the longer you know each other would be a useful rule for avoiding such situations.

Why is "fear of abandonment" the only way to get to "quality time"?